SDCC Factory Entertainment Frankenstein

[fmofmpls]

He's kind of smiling.  And I guess that is what is off about him.

He's smiling because he's buzzed from all the voltage consumption.

I like the concept .. just not sold on the grin and the similarity to the Cineart bust. But that's only because I already own the Cineart bust.


[admin]And now on a more serious note - Bobby has already pointed out that potentially libelous comments will not be allowed at this thread, or any other UMA thread for that matter. Please adhere to his warning. [/admin]

[Hellbilly1965]

shut me up all you want... im just taking my stand on this to a higher level.

[Toy Ranch]

Hellbilly1965, we are not here to "shut you up".  We are simply trying to keep the peace on our forum.  This place is not for waging wars of words with others, whether they are monster fans or businesses like Factory.   You have clearly voiced your opinions on our forum, and those have not been removed or edited. If you wish to go any further with that, you need to take it up directly with Factory Ent, and/or with Miles Teves/Cineart. 

[Hellbilly1965]

I do understand, and i also apologize to UMA..

[Hellbilly1965]

I would like to share an email i got from Miles Teves......

Hi David

yes, it looks like he used my old sculpture as a basis for his version, strange that he chose to obliterate the detail, people do the damndest things.

~M

case closed in my opinion.

please post this as i will not take this any further...here.

[Toy Ranch]

Hellbilly1965~  You should also be aware that he has repeatedly stated it is a prototype. 

Here, for instance, is a picture of a prototype playset that Marx never made, but proposed in the 60's.



Clearly, MPC monsters can be seen on it.  Was Marx going to recast MPC figures for their playset?  No.  But for the prototype phase, they used them.

Something else to consider...

The Aurora models were used in dozens of toys in the 60's.  Some licensed, and some not.  The AHI monsters were all Aurora heads.  The Monster Niks, Monster Men, many jigglers, charms, cereal premiums, etc. from the 60's and 70's were all straight rips off the Aurora models, mostly with some slight retooling.  Nobody is going on a "burn down all AHI monsters" crusade.  This is a different time, I understand.  What Barry has said about it leads me to believe that either he is absolutely certain it's an original sculpt (with obvious influence from the Teves bust) or he has been deceived by his sculptor.  It's very possible that someone sat down, next to a Teves bust, and used that as a model to sculpt Frankenstein.  Miles said in his email that it looks like his...  OK... we all agree with that.  It does LOOK like a Teves bust.  And most of us also feel that it's not as good.  The logical assumption is that it's a recast.  Maybe it's actually a copy.  I see artists painting copies of paintings in museums all the time.  That's how artists hone their craft, and if you are going to scuplt Frankenstein, and want a masterpiece to copy, them Miles Teves' work is the most likely piece to use.  Whether it's a violation of Cine Arts or Teves' copyrights is a topic for legal minds, and I'm not one of those.  If Cine Arts or Teves decide to pursue the matter is totally up to them.  It's not up to you or me.  Personally, I'm just glad that a company like Factory Ent exists and is making cool monster stuff.  This piece isn't up my personal alley, but I've bought other stuff from them, and hope to again in the future.

[Count_Zirock]

If I gave 2 talented sculptors known for doing accurate and lifelike sculptures the exact same reference photos and told each to sculpt the subject, I would expect two sculptures that would look very, very similar.
As a professional sculptor yourself, why does this surprise you?
If somebody hired you to sculpt Abe Lincoln from a photo would you put his mole on the other cheek of your bust [so it] didn't look like everyone else's?
If you were sculpting Scarface (the old mobster) would you move the scar and ignore the photo reference?

Still makes the most sense to me. Considering it's been nearly 15 years since the CineArts bust was released, Factory's decision to go with that very similar look could be simply a matter of timing.
I like the concept more than I like the finished piece. If a mini-bust were offered in, say, 1/4-scale at under $200, then I might be interested in one.

[Spock]

I find it hard to believe that Universal would license a recast

[Count_Zirock]

I find it hard to believe that Universal would license a recast

I'd find it harder to believe that Universal would know the difference, if that were actually the case. No, I find it harder to believe, given the knowledge base of hardcore Universal Frankenstein collectors, that any new licensee would attempt to pass off an old sculpt as a new one. It just wouldn't make sense. They know they'd get nailed in a minute. Even having a similar sculpt has roused criticism of, "I bought something like this 15 years ago, why should I buy it again?"

[Dr.Terror]

I feel dirty just clicking on the MMnet link

IMO it looks like someone did a clay press from a mold and re-tooled the cine-art sculpt.    And not a very good job at hiding it.   

The lack of skin detail could be from using a recast Thailand bust to make the mold from for the pressing.   I could mold an AHI frankenstein head,  make a clay press then but his bolts on his forehead and alter the mouth a little.   Tech, it's a new sculpt, but its also still an AHI Frankenstein. 

[Factory]

Ok we will say it again for the last time. There is no plot or secret story here.

It is not a recast of any existing product. Its a totally new sculpt created by Douglas Hilderbrandt

Wait for the item to come out and put it side by side against a Cinearts piece. The images you are looking at are confusing the issue, they are not official images from us and some are of old prototype product. I can find several images of the  Cinearts busts that look nothing like ours, It depends on the angles and lighting etc. The truth is that until our product and the Cinearts bust are compared directly, side by side, nobody can  make an accurate and correct assessment. I welcome the day that happens and will happily submit to the closest scrutiny based on fact. But do not judge us and make accusations based on assumption. I wish I owned a Cinearts bust so I could take a picture now, but i don't have one. I missed out back in the day. We have the greatest respect for Mr. Teves and his work, his bust is one of the finest sculpts ever produced and we are happy to go on record to say that. But we did not recast or copy it.

Does our product look similar to his piece for Cinearts? Sure, it absolutely does. Why? Because they are of the same subject, Karloff as Frankenstein in 1931 and are supposed to be 'life-like' representations not stylized . Any good sculptor will duplicate the same details and proportions when creating the same type of 1:1 scale item in this manner because they are copying his appearance. Also because this is a licensed product we are required to follow the licensing guidelines and are provided with 'style guide' reference material and approved imagery as a source. Probably the same material Cinearts was given by Universal back in the late 90's. When you produce licensed merchandise you do not have carte blanche to do what you want, you have to follow the  'official' line . This is one of the reasons why you see the same types of product again and again.  Universal own the trademark to the Pierce make up style and have a strict pattern of rules that govern its look to protect their rights to it, when you start to stray from it then you are not creating 'their' look.  Our piece was hand sculpted in clay using stills and a life cast of Karloff taken some time during his career, this was used for proportions and geometry. 

What is perceived as a lack of skin detail is in part a misunderstanding. The images that are being shown are a low res low quality and do not show the detail that is there. Its also a creative choice, we have chosen to portray a human actor wearing heavy period stage make-up. It is our belief that this would have obscured the pores and wrinkles in the skin and would have been more of a coating. It would not have had the appearance of more modern airbrushed make-up effects. This is partly  an artistic choice as we have no evidence to support it. Sadly close up high res images from the period do not exist to the best of our knowledge. But partly also it was a production decision. This piece is  thick heavy polyresin, because it contains mains AC operated electronics it has to be safe. Resin tends to have a shiny and sometimes greasy look unless it is textured, so it has been lightly textured. Many previous works have attempted to create the monster as he would have looked in real life, if he were a real Monster. we are trying to create a character replica.

This piece is aimed at people who don't already have a bust, and to appeal to the broadest number of people. This means it has what is considered to be the 'classic' look. The stoic dead expression. Its what the average consumer expects . This product is not aimed at somebody who already has one or more of the several busts that have been available over the years. We realize that people have limited space and you simply cannot have or afford them all. But there has never really been anything like this before. Its official name is the 'VFX Maquette 1:1 Scale Character Replica' we don't even call it bust. Its a feature piece that does things, it lights up you play with it, you interact with it. It's designed to fit in a home theater or a monster room and be 'used' not just admired.

We are trying something new we get that and there is bound to be some negative feedback.Also some people just don't like it, they will never like it. We get that too. Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

But please we ask everybody to judge us on facts not speculation. Wait for us to release official images of the actual finished piece, which will be available in both a colored and monochome paint deco.

Then we welcome your honest and open feedback.  But please no more unfounded and unfair accusations of recasting.

[hammerfan]

if you posted pics of the original sculpt that might dowse the torches....

[Factory]

By your command.

These are images of the 'clay' master (its actually a type of wax-epoxy). This is then used to create the mold .

www.factoryreplicas.com/art_staff/Frank/111216.jpg

www.factoryreplicas.com/art_staff/Frank/111217.jpg

And just to compare Apples with Apples... a side by side comparison with the Tevas Bust. Similar, but not the same by any means

www.factoryreplicas.com/art_staff/Frank/comp.jpg

[Toy Ranch]

http://www.factoryreplicas.com/art_staff/Frank/111216.jpg

Lower right corner, it looks like you recast the retaining ring of a jug.  Not to mention a commercially available on/off switch... How can you live with yourself?




...

[Factory]

In the words of the great scribe

"how do you know she is a witch?"

"She looks like one"


Its a fair cop guv!