As of Saturday afternoon (and after over a week of intensive research and discussion) I think the Mystery of the Monster school bag has been solved. I believe it to be a legit Standard Plastics Products, Inc. 1960s school/tote bag, made for the Canadian market- I personally think for Niagra Falls tourists.
Back up one week- the day of the bag auction. I went to a buddy's house after work (an 'old car' nut, and also into 50s/60s, collectibles, toys, music memoribilia, etc. plus a good researcher and thinker). We got to talking about this school bag, and I showed him the auction on ebay. We had discussed all the heat this thing had caused on the internet, and the possibilities that this thing was either real (which most people agreed it didn't look like, nor had anyone ever heard of before) or a more recently made piece of memoribilia (a real possibility, esp. after I had been told a Halloween-theme Monster bag was done, using my supplied artwork photos of the Wallet art). There was no doubt the complete artwork exisited, and there were copies of it around, as I had traded copies off back in the Toy Shop days-like 20 years ago. An amatuer-made creation had to be considered a real possibility. I told him earlier in the week I had exchanged a few emails with the owner of the Monster Bag (who I thought was a woman named Fran), and who in emails was very nice and very insistent that the bag was real. So, in the midst of our bag discussion, we started looking around on search engines for any proof that this thing might be authentic.
After a couple of hours of brain busting (and several drinks) later, we found this photo on a Beatles site, identified as a Canada-only 1960s Standard Plastics Beatles school bag...
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g107/backlotcharlie/SchoolBagbeatles.jpg)
And here is what we were looking for; identical to the Monster bag, and according to the Beatles site made for the Canadian market, where the Monster bag was being sold. We decided that this was enough evidence to put a bid in on it. (Yep, technically I'm half owner- but it will be mine, eventually!)
Since then, further investigation revealed that all SPP did was lift the artwork off the USA Beatles wallet, put in on a bag TWICE (cheesey!), and write "THE BEATLES" on the flap. The Beatles signatures in the middle of the bag is the flip side to the USA Beatles wallet, so there it is, both the Beatles AND the Monster bags have 3 SSP wallet images across them...1-2-3. SIDE NOTE: A funny thing about the Beatles wallet, if you look close, Paul has a CIGARETTE in his hand! How did that slip by?
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g107/backlotcharlie/Untitled-1-1.jpg)
...and in comparing the two, they are indeed identical, and upon seeing the Monster bag in person, it is most definately a vintage original 1960s piece. The only difference between the two is the Beatles' clasp is gold, the Monster bag clasp is silver.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g107/backlotcharlie/beatlesmonsterbag.jpg)
After talking it out, we came to the conclusion that these bags were likely made for the Canadian Niagra Falls tourist trade, for a couple of reasons. 1. Monsters were huge at Niagra Falls at the time- several attractions (House of Frankenstein, House of Dracula, Boris Karloff museum, etc.), and 2.The Beatles were huge new additions at wax museums. I am pretty sure that Madame Tusseau at Niagra had a well-promoted wax Beatles display, and that the Beatles themselves donated a set of their signature outfits for the wax figures (I think Sotheby's auctioned these very outfits a few years back). 3. SSP was located in the Northeast USA, not that far physically from Niagra, which was probably the closest large tourist trap.
And that's what we came up with. I have since talked with the bag's seller on the phone (who turned out to be a man named Mark) and he is a good guy. Ironically, he has some Aurora kits in his collection- which was his interest in the bag when he got it. He was understandably upset about the bag discussion, but as I told him, nobody had ever seen this thing before, and fan/fantasy items run rampant in the collecting community, so it was challenged, but not to take it personally. With that, this Monster tale is...in the bag.
Incredible detective work!!!!
Closure is an awesome thing :) However, reading this mystery was more excitement than I've had in a long time! I was checking hourly to see how this would unravel. I now realize how much monster knowledge is at my fingertips.
Sherlock Holmes would be proud...great detective work, Bob!
It's great to have the mystery solved!
Thank you for your relentlessness with this mystery!
Somehow I knew if this mystery was ever solved, you would be behind it.
Great sleuthing
Matt
Awesome detective work!!
Great job! Looks like you've solved another mystery! I wonder what the going rate would be on this if it were more like Marx Monsters, wallets or other fondly remembered monster items from that time period? There would be more of them floating around (possibly decreasing value) but many would also have the Monster kid memories to go along with it (possibly increasing value)...........
Then this is certainly the one that got away! Based on the value of those wallets this bag should have sold for much more. Bob, thanks for the due diligence.
GOOD WORK ON THIS ....BUT...I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHY ON THE BEATLES BAG THERE IS THE TRADE MARK ON THE BOTTOM OF THE BAG AS WE CAN SEE VERY EASY ..WHY NOT ON THE MONSTER BAG .....BIG JOHN......
This was answered before. It is printed on the Monster artwork itself.
I wonder though, if both of these bags could have possibly been snuck under the wire legally- possibly another reason they were sold in Canada only?
THANKS FOR THE QUICK ANSWER......WELL IF THESE WERE OUT THERE I'M SURE THEY SHOULD START POPPING UP SOON ....JUST LIKE THE WOLFMAN AIR DOLLS.... WHEN I SEE A COUPLE MORE OF THESE I WILL IN YOUR CORNER BUT I STILL THINK ITS A BOOTLEG OR HOMEMADE TILL SOMEONE OR ONE OF ARE OWN U.M.A MEMBERS KNOWS SOMEONE THAT HAS ONE....MONEY IS OUT THERE IF SOMEONE SEEN THE AUCTION THEY WILL PUT IT UP ... IF ITS THE REAL DEAL IT SHOULD HAVE SOLD AT LEAST DOUBLE THE PRICE.......TO MANY MONSTER CRAZY SPENDERS TO LET IT GO BUY THAT CHEAP.. WHAT DO YOU THINK BOB........BIG JOHN......
Frankly, I'd sure like to see another one pop up somewhere, or at least an advertisement.
HELLO FOR SURE..... ALL OF US ON THE U.M.A ..NO ONE HAS ONE..... I SEEN SOME OF YOUR ROOMS I'M SAYING THAT I NEVER SEEN SO MANY COOL ITEMS AND TOP TOP QUALITY.......BUT NO ONE HAS THIS BAG.....NO ONE KNOWS THIS BAG......IVE SEEN BEATLES ITEMS OVER AND OVER.......I STILL WANT TO SEE ONE MORE BAG CLOSE UP ...... TILL THEN HOMEMADE......BIG JOHN
It is positively a vintage and authentic piece. Absolutely no doubt about it.
I doubt you've seen that Beatles bag. It is, according to the Beatles site, extremely rare. There are literally hundreds, even thousands of Beatles items out there. In just SSP products alone, there are dozens of variations. The SSP Beatles wallets and binders came in like 8-10 color variations alone!
I can finally sleep! Thank you.
What did the bags your friend made look like, then?
Sounds like the seller was dead-on right about everything except James Bama.
Interesting investigative work Bob. That Beatles bag makes a strong case for the monster bag and its legitimacy. If this entire saga hadn't left such a sour taste in my mouth, I'd be much more excited. However, I'm scarred from ever wanting to see or even own one of these bags. I know .. get over it Terry. And I will. Sounds like this one's "in the bag."
Quote from: Monster Bob on July 12, 2010, 10:44:03 AM
He was understandably upset about the bag discussion, but as I told him, nobody had ever seen this thing before, and fan/fantasy items run rampant in the collecting community, so it was challenged, but not to take it personally.
There were many parts of this entire debacle which were easily taken personally and out of context. Thanks Bob for pointing this fact out to Mark. All is forgiven at my end. And I hope at his end as well.
And with that having been said ....
* WARNING - let's continue to use this thread to discuss the bag itself and nothing more! The mods will remove any post that isn't directly related to the item. We will NOT be discussing the auction or the seller. Thank you for your cooperation.
Kudos on your win and on your fantastic detective skills. Being a life long optimist, it's wonderful to see this be legit.
I'm just amazed that there are still new things to find out there
Sweet closure!
Bob, I'm still curious about the 90s company promotion theory. At what point was this deemed untrue? I thought you had solid information regarding this theory from a respected source? Just curious.
Don't know that it is untrue, but this sure ain't it. I distributed copies of the SSP art to several people in the late 1980s (which then got redistributed). I have never seen this Halloween bag, only going by word of mouth. It may well have been a fabric sack for all I know. I did have a licensed Frankenstein, Creature, and Dracula Halloween sack twenty-ish years ago (long since sold), but it was completely different art. Not even close. Someone reportedly put the SSP art on the binders also (like a piece of paper slid in a clear plastic front- not a "manufactured" or printed item, but I've never seen one of those either. Had I known it was going to happen, I wouldn't have given it out.
This Monster bag is 100% old and sixties era and built like a brick 'chithouse. I had a plain blue and white bag similar but different to this (no strap, with a clasp that turned-this one snaps) in about 1967. They haven't produced bags like this since the 1960s-too much labor in construction and material, I suppose. It would be a $50 bag nowadays. The SSP monster bag's art was manufacted exactly as Richard pointed out with the wallets- they put down a layer of white, then the color layers (R-Y-B) so the colors would be vivid and "pop" off the white. The art was definately applied before the bag was assembled, as the art goes right to the sewn-on vinyl trim, almost under in a couple of spots. The thread has darkened and yellowed with age- see pic. It would be impossible to put this art on in this technique on an already assembled bag. The picture is also made up of "dots" and made in layers, just like the wallets (whatever that technique is called). I can't make it any clearer than this pic-(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g107/backlotcharlie/EBAYMAY2010153.jpg)
After almost 50 years with this stuff, I can tell you 110% certainty it is absolutely real and authentic. And the hardware and assembly is absolutely identical to the Canada SSP Beatles School Bag, which has been known about for over 20 years-it is in the old collector books. I'm sticking with the Niagra Falls thing, too.
Quote from: Monster Bob on July 14, 2010, 09:03:38 AM
I can tell you 110% certainty it is absolutely real and authentic.
Oh, I believe you alright. Thanks for the clarification and for the pics. Mystery solved.
As always Bob, thanks for doing the research and sharing the info. This is the kind of stuff I thrive on.
On a possibly related note, do you have any definitive info about the 3 monster binders that were produced in the '60s? I ask in relation to this post as I sometimes see the binders refered to as SPP - which I don't believe they could be due not just the art but the style of manufacture. We monster kids often refer to them as Hasbro (Hassenfeld Brothers at the time), due to the art from the 1963/64 Oil Painting By Number Sets being used on them, yet school supplies were not offered via wholesale in Hassenfeld toy catalogues. The company did produce pencil boxes and the like at one time, but I've never seen other character items that would fit in as an assortment - the way the Beatles and Monster bags do. Have you - or anyone else - ever seen other items or old vendor catalogues that shore up Hassenfeld Brothers producing the Dracula, Frankenstein and Wolf Man binders?
Quote from: Monster Bob on July 14, 2010, 09:03:38 AMSomeone reportedly put the SSP art on the binders also (like a piece of paper slid in a clear plastic front- not a "manufactured" or printed item, but I've never seen one of those either.
The SSP monster bag's art was manufacted exactly as Richard pointed out with the wallets- they put down a layer of white, then the color layers (R-Y-B) so the colors would be vivid and "pop" off the white.
Do you mean the SPP art?
???
Quote from: Monster Bob on July 12, 2010, 10:44:03 AMAnd that's what we came up with. I have since talked with the bag's seller on the phone (who turned out to be a man named Mark) and he is a good guy. Ironically, he has some Aurora kits in his collection- which was his interest in the bag when he got it. He was understandably upset about the bag discussion, but as I told him, nobody had ever seen this thing before, and fan/fantasy items run rampant in the collecting community, so it was challenged, but not to take it personally.
Was this fellow "Mark" a UMA member?
Have any other SPP monster school bags surfaced since?
???
Incidentally, here is the original thread:
http://www.universalmonsterarmy.com/forum/index.php?topic=9652.0 (http://www.universalmonsterarmy.com/forum/index.php?topic=9652.0)
:-\
Quote from: darkmonkeygod on July 14, 2010, 10:51:05 PMOn a possibly related note, do you have any definitive info about the 3 monster binders that were produced in the '60s? I ask in relation to this post as I sometimes see the binders refered to as SPP - which I don't believe they could be due not just the art but the style of manufacture. We monster kids often refer to them as Hasbro (Hassenfeld Brothers at the time), due to the art from the 1963/64 Oil Painting By Number Sets being used on them, yet school supplies were not offered via wholesale in Hassenfeld toy catalogues. The company did produce pencil boxes and the like at one time, but I've never seen other character items that would fit in as an assortment - the way the Beatles and Monster bags do. Have you - or anyone else - ever seen other items or old vendor catalogues that shore up Hassenfeld Brothers producing the Dracula, Frankenstein and Wolf Man binders?
As a courtesy to newer members, we now know that the binders depicting the Universal monster artwork that was also used for the Hasbro Mystery Games and Paint & Pencil by Number sets were neither produced nor marketed by SPP:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3106/2386697422_a0d2c7dd65_o.jpg)
SPP made many binders including Weird-Ohs and Beatles binders but not the three binders pictured above.
:)
Incidentally here are the best pictures I can find of the rare SPP Monster School Bag that's the subject of discussion here:
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4093/4757734273_e91d41ec38_o.jpg)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4102/4757734255_be25b58450_b.jpg)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4135/4757734129_dbfdbff3d0_b.jpg)
And here for comparison's sake is the SPP Beatles School Bag:
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g434/Balticprince/beatlesmonsterbag.jpg?width=450&height=278&fit=bounds&crop=fill)
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g434/Balticprince/Beatles_bag.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds)
:)
These printer's proof sheets for an SPP sales brochure indicate that SPP also produced Superman and Batman school bags nearly identical to those above:
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g434/Balticprince/SPP_Superman(1).jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds)
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g434/Balticprince/SPP_Batman.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds)
Plus this Skipper Purse-Pal Doll Case which was available in baby blue or pink is very similar in construction as well:
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g434/Balticprince/(edited)_SPP_Skipper_4.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds)
8)
(https://iili.io/FKg1r7.jpg)
Wow, that's it! The exact same bag as the Universal Monsters, Beatles, Superman and Batman ones! So SPP made at least five anyway in the exact same style.
:)