Hi guys,
Does anyone know how to tell vintage 1963 famous monsters binders from repros?
I would appreciate any knowledge or help.
please email me at huedez(*at*)yahoo.com if you would be so kind.
My thanks for your expertise.
Hugo
I believe on the repros the xerox artwork is just slid into the clear front 'pocket' of the binder. On the original, it is sealed inside the plastic. But I guess it depends on which repro you're looking at. I would think you could tell easily from the ring mechanism inside if it is old or new.
Quote from: hugohernandez on December 14, 2011, 09:53:57 PM
Hi guys,
Does anyone know how to tell vintage 1963 famous monsters binders from repros?
I would appreciate any knowledge or help.
please email me at huedez(*at*)yahoo.com if you would be so kind.
My thanks for your expertise.
Hugo
If I may step in, I'd like people to reply here at the forum so that we can all benefit from the information. I'm sure there are other members who would like to know how to tell repros from originals. And there might be some disagreement about whether a particular detail is evidence of a fake. For instance, are there originals where the paper can be removed, or are they always sealed?
Seems like I read somewhere (maybe here!) that the original binders had rounded outer corners, whereas the repros do not have the rounded corners. The photos in the gallery seem to support this... :)
Thanks guys for all the help. Ray thank you for asking them to post answers here. I wasn't thinking.
It sounds like the old ones are not only sealed and rounded corners but does anybody know if the picture inside was just paper or was it on thick cardboard?
that might be the big decider on what is repro and not.
Also does anyone have an older binder? I am assuming from the picture at landlcollectables.com that the original binders were also thicker. The pic shows big rings which means the spine is pretty wide. Look under the monster gallery section under frankenstein.
Hugo
the original.........250.00 to 500.00 --sometimes higher------.......---- repros 19.99 to 30.00...................your choice.........
Quote from: ICEMANN333 on December 17, 2011, 10:11:14 AM
the original.........250.00 to 500.00 --sometimes higher------.......---- repros 19.99 to 30.00...................your choice.........
I would choose originals.
Agreed.
Hey guys, I got the definitive answer from an old UMA member who found his old post and sent it to me along with generous pics of original binder vs. the horrible yucky why bother repros.
Here is his info in a nutshell.
Original is wide spine with 2 gold rivets showing on the spine. Repro has no rivets, skinny spine and added extra slip pocket inside.
Original picture is not only sealed but picture was laminated on to thick 1/8 inch cardboard. Repro is thin paper which you can clearly see right away.
This fountain of important info was passed down to me by an expert with an extensive collection.
and passed onto you all here. I don't think he would mind that I am passing it on here as he told me he originally posted it previously on this site, but long ago.
Thanks again, for all your help and know WE ALL KNOW how to tell them apart.
Hugo again, the gold rivets are incorrect, they are actually silver but because his binders were old, the pictures showed them to be brass colored or gold. He informed me that with age, they might turn color.
PLease check out my wanted ad if anybody has extras.
I had the Frankenstein from the 60's and remember the cardboard that the pic was printed on was very thick and hard. I have not seen the repros but maybe that might tell the difference.
Quote from: hugohernandez on December 18, 2011, 10:44:20 AM
Hey guys, I got the definitive answer from an old UMA member who found his old post and sent it to me along with generous pics of original binder vs. the horrible yucky why bother repros.
Here is his info in a nutshell.
Original is wide spine with 2 gold rivets showing on the spine. Repro has no rivets, skinny spine and added extra slip pocket inside.
Original picture is not only sealed but picture was laminated on to thick 1/8 inch cardboard. Repro is thin paper which you can clearly see right away.
This fountain of important info was passed down to me by an expert with an extensive collection.
and passed onto you all here. I don't think he would mind that I am passing it on here as he told me he originally posted it previously on this site, but long ago.
Thanks again, for all your help and know WE ALL KNOW how to tell them apart.
Post what he sent you.
I have some of both. I'll post pics tonight (if I have time).
The 1960's original binders have the same artwork as the 1963 Hasbro paint by numbers. The outer edges of the binders are rounded. The binder width is 2". I have a set of the originals as well as a set of the cardboard inserts, but none of the repros, so cannot speak of them.
here are the pics he sent me. Don't know if I needed his permission or not. He said they were somewhere on this site.
(http://i1135.photobucket.com/albums/m635/huedez/binder4.jpg)(http://i1135.photobucket.com/albums/m635/huedez/binder2.jpg)
(http://i1135.photobucket.com/albums/m635/huedez/binder3.jpg)(http://i1135.photobucket.com/albums/m635/huedez/binder1.jpg)
I just took the inserts out of my repros and framed the artwork.
Good idea! Do you have them all?
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3106/2386697422_a0d2c7dd65_o.jpg)
???
Apologies for bringing up such an old post but I was hoping someone could answer a question for me.
I know with the originals each binder said the name of the monster, with the repros they just said "Famous Monsters of Filmland," correct? And the logo, the binder I have came across has the image with the FM logo, but the logo looks like it was originally cut out of the magazine and affixed to the image before they made copies to put in the binder.
I'm hoping someone with the repos could shed some light on this for me.
Thanks!
The ones in Hepcat's post, above, are the original 1960s binders made by SPP. The 1990s ones made by Ray Ferry, when he was publishing FM, had a Phantom, a Wolfman that looked like the Aurora art and a Frank and Drac that looked like the originals. He used a computer program to add the FM logo to the images. These aren't technically repros.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/2f0en11.jpg)
(http://i58.tinypic.com/2mrigba.jpg)
So would this be a "bootleg" of the 90's reissues? It looks like the logo from cut right from a magazine and pasted onto this, then the image was used to make copies.
Quote from: cannibalchris on June 07, 2014, 05:05:42 PM
So would this be a "bootleg" of the 90's reissues?
It's certainly very strange! The one I have (a Phantom) is very professionally done. Is the picture sealed in, or can it be removed?
It can be removed. It's not sealed and on the inside it says it's a AVERY binder.
Ray Ferry did 3 pro binders, good images, sealed in, non-removeable.
then he did some xerox images with plastic sleeves in the front to slide image in. this mummy binder shows that is removeable from front sleeve and the image is poorly reproduced.
He said he wanted to keep the cost down so he stopped making the sealed binder. hence making them somewhat collectable. I know, I paid 75.00 for Frankenstein off of ebay.
the other 3 pictured are very nice additions to the older FM binders indeed.
(http://i1135.photobucket.com/albums/m635/huedez/monsters_zps5f8b1f45.jpg) (http://s1135.photobucket.com/user/huedez/media/monsters_zps5f8b1f45.jpg.html)
Thanks for the info, Hugo! I didn't know about these later Ferry binders. The Mummy looks like the SPP wallet art, as does the Phantom. Both probably repainted. The Frank is not the original SPP binder art. Looks like the later ones use the monster name, rather than the FM logo.
Ray Ferry did the Wolfman, Frankenstein, & Phantom sealed binders. There was no Dracula sealed version. There was another person selling binders, I believe named Samjo. He was selling the Dracula binder where the image was removable.
JP
Quote from: Mike Scott on June 07, 2014, 04:39:39 PMThe ones in Hepcat's post, above, are the original 1960s binders made by SPP.
I don't believe that SPP was the company that made those original binders though. SPP made the Weird-Ohs binders but a different company, perhaps an affiliate of Hasbro, made the three original Universal monster binders.
???
Quote from: Wolfman on June 09, 2014, 07:59:29 AM
Ray Ferry did the Wolfman, Frankenstein, & Phantom sealed binders. There was no Dracula sealed version.
Thanks, JP!
Quote from: Wolfman on June 09, 2014, 07:59:29 AM
There was another person selling binders, I believe named Samjo. He was selling the Dracula binder where the image was removable.
He was selling repros of the '60s binders, along with repros of the Horrorscope and Bike Buddy. Maybe other things?
Quote from: Hepcat on June 09, 2014, 09:21:39 AM
I don't believe that SPP was the company that made those original binders though.
Yes, you're right. I've been calling them that for so many years that it's hard to stop! :laugh: I guess it was finally decided that they are Hasbro after all (or a complete mystery).
That's correct Mike, he was selling those other knock-offs as well. I actually bought the 60's repro Dracula binder with the name Dracula on it. So, it does look like someone cut & attached the FM logo to the image shown in this thread.
JP
Quote from: Wolfman on June 09, 2014, 09:33:01 AM
So, it does look like someone cut & attached the FM logo to the image shown in this thread.
It would appear so and, apparently, the guy doesn't have Photoshop. ;D
Quote from: Mike Scott on June 09, 2014, 09:26:36 AM
Yes, you're right. I've been calling them that for so many years that it's hard to stop! :laugh: I guess it was finally decided that they are Hasbro after all (or a complete mystery).
They use the Hasbro oil paint by numbers and pencil by numbers art work, but I don't know of anyone who has knowledge they were produced or distributed by Hasbro. To date, and tmk, no wholesale catalogues have turned up with these binders in them. Does anyone know of products like this that Hasbro sold?
Quote from: darkmonkeygod on June 10, 2014, 01:56:53 PM
Does anyone know of products like this that Hasbro sold?
There was a big thread on this, a while back, but I don't recall if anybody turned up any Hasbro made binders of any kind?
Quote from: Mike Scott on June 10, 2014, 02:01:17 PM
There was a big thread on this, a while back, but I don't recall if anybody turned up any Hasbro made binders of any kind?
My recollection is they did not, but I can't find the thread to confirm.
Quote from: darkmonkeygod on June 10, 2014, 08:12:37 PM
My recollection is they did not, but I can't find the thread to confirm.
I kinda think not, too. Let's call them "Unknown, most likely Hasbro."
Quote from: darkmonkeygod on June 10, 2014, 08:12:37 PM
My recollection is they did not, but I can't find the thread to confirm.
Hasbro produced notebook binders of Dr. Kildare and Ben Casey from 1962 which are all stamped Hasbro. They were made in the same manner but with a photo rather than artwork sealed in clear plastic in white binders. I believe I posted a photo last year during a similar discussion. I'm currently away from my photo files, so I can't post. A Ben Casey was recently on ebay if someone wants to view it.
Thanks RPM! I remember that, now. Here's the auction pic. More pics in the auction.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-BEN-CASEY-M-D-DOCTOR-NOTE-BOOK-BING-CROSBY-PRODUCTION-HASBRO-TV-SCRIPTS-/261485939629?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3ce1c6cbad (http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-BEN-CASEY-M-D-DOCTOR-NOTE-BOOK-BING-CROSBY-PRODUCTION-HASBRO-TV-SCRIPTS-/261485939629?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3ce1c6cbad)
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NDc1WDUwMA==/z/Kt0AAOxycD9TVtzF/$_12.JPG)
Quote from: RPM on June 10, 2014, 10:00:38 PM
Hasbro produced notebook binders of Dr. Kildare and Ben Casey from 1962 which are all stamped Hasbro. They were made in the same manner but with a photo rather than artwork sealed in clear plastic in white binders. I believe I posted a photo last year during a similar discussion. I'm currently away from my photo files, so I can't post. A Ben Casey was recently on ebay if someone wants to view it.
SWEET! This is so much of what I love about the UMA. Thank you!
It seems to me if Hasbro produced the Oil paintings whose box art is exactly the same as the binders. See what I mean?
speaking of seeing, why didn't anybody alert the community aka US at UMA that there were 6 Hasbro Monster paint by number (exquisitely rendered) paintings on ebay?
I found out too late and they had already been split up and half of them sold.
Had I found the initial listing for all six, I would have GLadly bought the whole set.
I don't think those paintings come around so often!
I had never seen a creature offered up let alone the Phantom and the Mummy.
Even Dracula, Frankenstein and the Wolfman are rare in my monster collecting experience.
wouldn't you agree?
Quote from: hugohernandez on June 11, 2014, 08:42:52 AM
It seems to me if Hasbro produced the Oil paintings whose box art is exactly the same as the binders. See what I mean?
We do, but why didn't they put the Hasbro logo on them, like the Ben Casey? Although they likely are Hasbro, it would be nice to have that last bit of proof. :)
Quote from: hugohernandez on June 11, 2014, 08:42:52 AM
why didn't anybody alert the community aka US at UMA that there were 6 Hasbro Monster paint by number paintings on ebay?
People get pissed off when you do that, if the auction is still "live". They don't want any competition for the rare stuff. ;D
I have seen plenty of not so called alerts but threads talking about current auctions, Grail stuff too!
example, the bike buddy auction. UMA was talking up a storm for that auction.
anyways, just curious as to why the previous auctions of Hasbro Paint by Number didn't show.
Quote from: hugohernandez on June 11, 2014, 08:42:52 AM
It seems to me if Hasbro produced the Oil paintings whose box art is exactly the same as the binders. See what I mean?
I don't understand.
Quote from: hugohernandez on June 11, 2014, 11:58:04 AM
I have seen plenty of not so called alerts but threads talking about current auctions, Grail stuff too!
Could have been some other reason. Who knows!
Quote from: darkmonkeygod on June 11, 2014, 12:09:35 PM
I don't understand.
Therefore the binders should be Hasbro, too, would be the thinking.
Quote from: hugohernandez on June 11, 2014, 11:58:04 AManyways, just curious as to why the previous auctions of Hasbro Paint by Number didn't show.
Whenever an Ebay auction is highlighted with a thread on UMA, attention is drawn to that item. And it's not just from posting members; a lot of lurkers who couldn't care less about the membership here read this board. The Ebay item therefore ends up getting far more bidding action, i.e. the price is pushed up a lot higher. This is very annoying to any UMA member trying to buy the item for himself. I mean why did somebody have to tell the world about it?
>:(
Quote from: darkmonkeygod on June 11, 2014, 12:09:35 PM
I don't understand.
the binders and the box top art for the Frank, drac and Wolfman Hasbro PBN's are exactly the same art.
so it makes sense to me that Hasbro also made the binders.
see?
Quote from: Hepcat on June 11, 2014, 02:08:36 PM
Whenever an Ebay auction is highlighted with a thread on UMA, attention is drawn to that item. And it's not just from posting members; a lot of lurkers who couldn't care less about the membership here read this board. The Ebay item therefore ends up getting far more bidding action, i.e. the price is pushed up a lot higher. This is very annoying to any UMA member trying to buy the item for himself. I mean why did somebody have to tell the world about it?
>:(
LOL. we are all connected.
the only way to find something without anyone else knowing about it is in person.
ie..garage sales, estate sales, yard sales.
those glory days of limited knowledge at toy shows and magazine ads in TOYSHOP are gone baby gone.
ah. the good ol days.
Just offering up what works for me. I will PM a member if I want to tell them about an ebay item, ask if they would consider selling, trading an item, etc.
Again, just sharing a best practice, so no worries. I remember ToyShop!! That publication ruled. Was like looking at your own private toy convention. Miss that for sure.
Thats right Darkside, that is a good idea.
but what I usually find is somebody gets so excited about certain auctions, that they can't help but sharing with a friend. that friend tells another friend and SO ON... then one little post is like a hole in a dyke..... it starts small, well you know the old story.....
next thing you know the site is all a chatter which for me is VERY EXCITING and the message boards really get a workout! Just my opinion.
btw, THERE IS A EBAY AUCTION FEATURING A RARE, NEVER SEEN BEFORE... oh never mind. Find it yourselves.
(lol)
Quote from: hugohernandez on June 11, 2014, 06:22:51 PM
LOL. we are all connected.
the only way to find something without anyone else knowing about it is in person.
ie..garage sales, estate sales, yard sales.
those glory days of limited knowledge at toy shows and magazine ads in TOYSHOP are gone baby gone.
ah. the good ol days.
For limited knowledge just scan ebay... plenty there. Things like an original 1961 Frankenstein Aurora kit listed with ORIGINAL SHRINK WRAP SEAL.....or ORIGINAL 60's Marx Monsters in PURPLE Color...and so on.
Quote from: monsterjoe on June 13, 2014, 10:50:38 PM...or ORIGINAL 60's Marx Monsters in PURPLE Color...and so on.
"Original" in purple? I'll file that under outright fraud.
::)
Quote from: monsterjoe on June 13, 2014, 10:50:38 PM
For limited knowledge just scan ebay... plenty there. Things like an original 1961 Frankenstein Aurora kit listed with ORIGINAL SHRINK WRAP SEAL.....or ORIGINAL 60's Marx Monsters in PURPLE Color...and so on.
;D All too true.
Quote from: Hepcat on February 28, 2012, 10:44:39 AM
Good idea! Do you have them all?
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3106/2386697422_a0d2c7dd65_o.jpg)
???
HEPCAT, where did you get this picture from. I ask only because the Wolfman binder has very distinctive markings on it. some kid colored in over on top of the vinyl with red markers, coloring in his eyes, some extra blood and oddly enough, his shirt at the inner elbow creases. This is one of a kind and I OWN IT. And I know for sure this is not MY PHOTO.
Quote from: hugohernandez on February 25, 2017, 12:23:14 PM
This is one of a kind and I OWN IT. And I know for sure this is not MY PHOTO.
Did you buy it used? Could the previous owner have taken the photo?
Quote from: hugohernandez on February 25, 2017, 12:23:14 PMHEPCAT, where did you get this picture from.
I guess I just lifted it off someone's Flicker feed. You might try to track the picture down from the address of the link.
:-\